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In the past, Bam dressed in outlandish makeup and costumes, and engaged in intentionally shocking behavior both onstage and off. His online rants received criticism for their anti-religious sentiment and references to sex, violence, suicide, gambling, and drugs, while his live performances were frequently called offensive and obscene. On several occasions, protests and petitions led to Bam being blocked from performing, with at least three US states passing legislation banning him from performing at state-owned venues. Bam is also quite notable for his paintings, some of which have sold for over $10,000. These paintings are highly stylized with fascist themes and propaganda which helped bring public recognition. Recently he was even wrongly investigated by the FBI. Today he is here to sit down with me and discuss art, symbolism, and Nazis.
Paul: How was your day?
Bam: I’ll get back to you tomorrow when the results are in.
Paul: *chuckles* I have never gotten that response before. Well let’s not waste time on small talk then. I’ve always wondered do you ever feel responsible for someone potentially doing something bad in your name? I’ve seen a lot of people, parents, call you irresponsible for how you use your platform and I am curious how you feel about that. You are an influence at the end of the day.
Bam: I think art is a freedom from responsibility. It is something you don’t have to do, you don’t have to listen to anyone, you don’t have to take care of anything, you don’t have to say anything. It is a pulpit to freely express whatever feelings or thoughts that have been otherwise internalized.
Paul: But what about when that irresponsibility causes people to harm themselves or others? Should some things not stay internal?
Bam: Well I think trying to remove me, what I create, or any form of art rather is the same as treating the cough not the illness. Why does it all stop at me? I find it flattering that people think all of life’s problems are solved and it’s time to focus on me but I don’t think it achieves anything even if you do completely remove me from existence. I am a product of the world, I am a product of this country, I am a product of you. It’s not like everything I say and do comes from nowhere. I respect people who don’t like me, don’t agree with me, and challenge me as long as they are honest about it. Where I lose respect for people is when their motivation lies in a dishonest appeal to morality.
Paul: Do you feel like people do that a lot? Use you to appear moral I mean.
Bam: Of course. Sometimes I don’t know who I’m offending or not offending; I can’t tell who is really being anything anymore.
Paul: Is that where your lack of concern with offending comes from?
Bam: No, the idea that you have to be protected from any kind of uncomfortable emotion is just something I do not subscribe to. I think it is pretty disgusting to watch people collectively abandon their own culture, values, and even sacrifice their futures on the altar of alleged progressivism.
Paul: Alleged? You don’t think they are trying to progress towards something better?
Bam: If you censor people then they aren’t able to challenge current conceptions which is how all progress is made. How else can you supplant existing institutions?
Paul: That is a really good question. I would need more time to think about it to give a proper answer. If we had more time i’d like to explore that more but since we don’t let’s talk about the Nazi imagery because that is where a lot of people draw the line on freedom. First let’s get this out of the way for anyone reading, are you a nazi or do you believe in Nazism?
Bam: I condemn Nazis and all forms of fascism.
Paul: Then why use Nazi and fascist imagery?
Bam: Well there are a multitude of reasons but the most important is I like how it looks.
Paul: You can’t just dress like a nazi because it’s fashionable!
Bam: *smiles* Well I also do it because I think it raises a challenge of values and beliefs. Hitler during his reign had this term, Entartete Kunst. Entartete Kunst means degenerate art. Anything he deemed degenerate art was banned in Nazi Germany. All surrealism was degenerate art, mickey mouse and Disney were banned. Today when I use fascist imagery, when I paint certain things, people ask for it and for me to be banned.
Paul: I see where you’re going with this. I want to be on your side but I find it really hard to justify the use of such hateful things. You could expose that hypocrisy or irony in different ways. Bam: Then it wouldn’t be as powerful. We wouldn’t be having this conversation right now
Paul: I still find it hard to justify the use that imagery
Bam: I can understand not approving of it but do you think I should be allowed to use that imagery?
Paul: I… I think.. Yes you should be allowed to but I do think you’re on the line of hateful. I think once things start to get hateful, censorship can be important.
Bam: We can agree to disagree on that.
Paul: I knew you wouldn’t agree with me on that. What made you start using propaganda so much in your work?
Bam: It goes with my image and other work well, I also love the art style of WWII era propaganda posters.
Paul: Come on… you know I want the deeper reason. You are the most symbolic person I know of, you are shockingly calculated with every little detail of your work.
Bam: Yeah I would say I secretly use an orderly means to fight for chaos where most people use a frenzied approach to fight for order.
Paul: I don’t think it’s a secret to people who know you or people that pay close attention. Bam: Maybe not. To answer your question though propaganda and indoctrination works. It’s been shown time and time again how easy it is for someone with a motive and a following to corrupt a large number of people in just a few short years by lying and demonizing something or someone. It can turn otherwise normal people into fanatics and murderers. I think that is a fun concept to play with. Every single poster has it’s own hidden messages and meanings.
Paul: Do people usually find all the things you hide in your work?
Bam: No, I have never seen someone find everything symbolic in anything I put out.
Paul: Can I have an example of something no one has found?
Bam: This one isn’t deep at all but my journal entry about selling my soul is 666 words.
Paul: Wow. I would never even think to check something like that.
Bam: Yeah that one is very surface level though. Most things are much more meaningful, at least to me.
Paul: How often do people discover something but misinterpret it?
Bam: Misinterpreted isn’t how I would describe anyone’s analysis. Everyone sees things differently and I don’t think anyone is wrong for what they see even if it is not what I envisioned when I made it.
Paul: Okay let me rephrase, how often do people come up with meanings that differ from yours?
Bam: All the time. It’s a rarity that I see an interpretation that aligns with what I was thinking when I made it.
Paul: Does it ever make you want to be more clear about your message? Bam: No, that is what speaking is for. I am very particular about my words. I believe that art is a question mark, it should never be an answer. When you show someone your painting you are asking them a question and it is on them to answer it.
Paul: That’s a Marilyn Manson viewpoint right?
Bam: Yes, I stole it from him and he stole it from someone else. This is the nature of art and human beings in general.
Paul: I knew I heard it from somewhere. Last question because we’re out of time. Do you think that canceling culture is some type of dark age for art because of how restrictive it is? Bam: No, if anything I believe it makes art more important and more influential. A dark age for art would mean that art is pointless which I can’t fathom a world where that would be the case.
Paul: Thank you so much for your time Bam. It is always great talking to you and I hope we can do this again soon. Everyone be sure to follow Bam @bamblows and to check out his website https://bamblows.com/
Bam: No problem. I always enjoy speaking to you as well.
